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| Poland Gets a Week's Delay on EU SW Patents |
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Monday, January 24 2005 @ 08:03 AM EST
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Once again,
Poland has blocked the rubber-stamping of the software patents
directive in Europe. There is, however, only a week's delay, to January 31, and then it comes up again. However, it gets harder and harder to pretend that this directive is so uncontroversial it belongs as an A item, meaning no discussion, just rubber-stamping. And a lot can happen in a week. The battleground now is over the restart process, as the FFII page points out.
The reason for that is this, I'm told by Jan Wildeboer of FFII:
"All our efforts are now towards restart in the European Parliament. The
delay (even if only one week) now gives us time till 21st of February to
get the restart started.
"Why? Quite simple. A restart can be initiated until the adopted
directive is announced in the Parliament. That can only be done at a
plenary session. The next plenary session is at 26/27 January. Due to
the delay that one is not reachable.
"So when they adopt next week, they can annouce it in EU-Parliament at
the next session which will be on 21/22 February.
"As soon as a restart process is initiated the announcement in the
parliament is not possible anymore.
"But this is also vice-versa. If the restart is *not* initiated till 21st
of February and the Council gets it adopted next week and it gets
announced on the 21st in Parliament there is no way to initiate the
restart anymore.
OK, so what I understand is that a
restart can be initiated only prior to an adopted
directive being announced in the Parliament. That can only be done at a
plenary session. The next plenary session is January 26 and 27. Due to
the week's delay, the pro software lobby has lost that opportunity. Thank you, Poland. However, if they
adopt the directive next week, they can annouce it in Parliament at
the next session on February 21 and 22.
But if there is a restart process initiated before that announcement, it blocks any announcement in the
Parliament.
But it cuts both ways. If there is no restart initiated before the 21st
of February and the council gets it adopted next week and it gets
announced on the 21st in Parliament, there is no way to initiate the
restart anymore. So both sides are going to be working on the timing. EU politics is hard for this colonist, and I hope I explained it correctly. Here are the Rules of Procedure of the European Parliament, including the restart process. What I do get is that the secret, behind-the-scenes rubber-stamping is not possible to carry out in the dark now. It's in the open and everyone is watching. My favorite translated sentence from the German article: The European Hightech branch federation EICTA, to which companies belong such as Microsoft, Nokia, SAP or Siemens, reacted disappointed to the time extension. I'm told both Heise and FFII will have articles in English later today, and the mayor of Munich is expected to speak about this later today also. UPDATE: Here is the article in Heise in English now, and it has plenty of news on what various groups are gearing up to try to accomplish next, and it ends like this: "In other words, the official adoption of the paper has once again been postponed unless there is some last-minute attempt within the Council this Monday to have the measure voted on. It remains unclear whether Luxembourg, which holds the presidency in the Council, will have another go at adopting the directive at the next meeting of ministers in a week. At any rate, the EU Parliament should have time to come to a consensus on whether to start the entire process over again by the time its plenary session begins on February 21." Here is an article from the newspaper De telegraaf in the Netherlands for those of you who can read it for us. I'm told it says, "EU Chairman Luxemburg could not say when the decision is to be expected." Here is what Sherlock does with it: The decision would be taken Monday in the fork of a meeting of
agriculture ministers. There however still insufficient agreement
proved to be. The patent on software is considerably controversial.
Small It-bedrijven fear in knel coming because large American commit
on a lot of astutenesses patent request. Bedrijfjes must will pay for
that considerably. It would obstruct the renewal of software.
At a similar meeting in December Poland blocked a decision. Much small
It-bedrijven house the country. Also the European Parliament is not
enthusiastic. Eu-voorzitter Luxembourg could not yet say when the
decision again to expect is. I'm sure MathFox can help us, or feel free to improve the translation. I can catch the drift however. They are mighty unhappy. And so are "large American commit on a lot of astuteness patent request" folks. Update: MathFox comes through:
Brussels - On Monday, the EU countries have postponed a decision on introducing software patents again. A spokesman of current EU-chair Luxemburg announced it Monday.
The decision would be taken Monday in the margin of a meeting of agriculture ministers. There still was insufficient agreement. Patents on software are considerably controversial. Small IT-companies fear to be squeezed because large American companies have applied for patents on a lot of ideas. Small companies will pay for that considerably. It would obstruct innovation in software.
At a similar meeting in December Poland blocked a decision. The country houses many small IT-companies. Also the European Parliament is not enthusiastic. EU-chairman Luxembourg could not yet say when the decision is to be expected again.
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| Authored by: DFJA on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 08:44 AM EST |
"EU politics is hard for this colonist"
Well for this lifelong EU member, it isn't really any easier.....
I think just as important as the issue of software patents, this whole saga is
showing just how undemocratic parts of the EU really are. I have generally been
in favour of closer EU integration until now, but I am seriously starting to
question whether it's all it's cracked up to be.
---
43 - for those who require slightly more than the answer to life, the universe
and everything[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 08:45 AM EST |
Thank Poland. It is important to get as many signatures on the list as
possible.[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 08:56 AM EST |
"colonist"?
Either a spelling mistake or a reference to the european settlers coming to
"America".
In case it's a typo, I'm mentioning it here.
Diddleydoo.[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: clark_kent on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:06 AM EST |
| What is on your mind? [ Reply to This | # ]
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- TheReg: Dozen claim MS codec patents - Authored by: macrorodent on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:37 AM EST
- Linux, Inc. - Businessweek.com - Authored by: clark_kent on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:42 AM EST
- Microsoft backs down in EU tussle - Authored by: BobDowling on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 12:22 PM EST
- OT Could someone with a more indepth knowledge than me.......... - Authored by: Brian S. on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 12:43 PM EST
- Netcraft: SCO Issues OpenSSL Patch, 10 Months Late - Authored by: worst-case on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 01:53 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 03:26 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: TerryC on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:00 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: stevem on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:10 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: rsteinmetz70112 on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:17 PM EST
- Perhaps posts are being held in a cache... - Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 06:20 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: gdeinsta on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 07:45 PM EST
- Bizarre postings timings: PJ, can you help? - Authored by: PJ on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 08:40 PM EST
- Article Microsoft considers patent suits - Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 06:49 PM EST
- Patrick Volkerding health status - Authored by: grouch on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 06:53 PM EST
- Hackers, crackers... - Authored by: weicco on Tuesday, January 25 2005 @ 03:25 AM EST
- Huh? - Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, January 25 2005 @ 01:33 PM EST
- Huh? - Authored by: weicco on Wednesday, January 26 2005 @ 02:36 AM EST
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| Authored by: Weeble on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:08 AM EST |
My first correction is that the first poster didn't start this thread! It
belongs up top! HRRRRUMPH!
---
On The Trailing Edge of Technology Since 1987.
[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Bart van Deenen on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:22 AM EST |
Hi all
The 'Telegraaf' is one of the largest Dutch newspapers.
I
translated the article as follows:
Decision on software-patents postponed
again
Brussels - On monday, the countries of the EU postponed again a
decision on
implementing software patents. A spokespersion of current EU
chairman
Luxemburg said so on monday.
The decision would have been taken on
monday, in the sidelines of a
meeting
of agriculture ministers. It turned out
there was insufficient agreement.
Software patents are quite controversial.
Small IT companies fear to become
mangled because large American companies
would claim patents on many
inventions. The small companies would have to pay
a lot. It would hinder
progress in the software industry.
During a similar
meeting in december, Poland blocked the decision. This
country has many small
IT companies. The European Parliament isn't
enthousiastic either. EU chairman
Luxembourg could not say when the
decision can be expected again. [ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 09:27 AM EST |
"The European Hightech branch federation EICTA, to which companies belong
such as Microsoft, Nokia, SAP or Siemens, reacted disappointed to the time
extension."
The majority of (real) people (not faceless money making machines ) who can see
the future of free/open/proper software is at stake only reacted disappointed
because this silly thing hasn't been dropped for good yet.
retep.
[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: pbakker on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 10:26 AM EST |
As was already pointed out by Anonymous in the OT thread, the news source
telegraaf.nl is Dutch. Since it is not in Luxenburgish but in Dutch, I can
provide a translation which should improve on that provided by Sherlock.
--
Decision over software patents again postponed.
BRUSSELS - The countries of the European Union on Monday again delayed a
decision over the introduction of software patents. A spokesman of the current
EU chairman Luxembourg announced this on Monday.
The decision would have been taken on Monday in the margin of a meeting of
agricultural ministers. It appeared, however, that there was still insufficient
agreement. Patents on software are quite controversial. Small IT companies fear
being put under pressure because large American companies apply for patents on
many inventions. The small companies will have to start paying considerable
sums. This would inhibit the renewal of software.
At a similar meeting in December Poland blocked a decision. The country houses
many small IT companies. The European Parliament is also not enthusiastic. EU
chairman Luxembourg could not yet say when the decision can be expected again.
[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 12:59 PM EST |
| De Telegraaf is a dutch newspaper. [ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 01:00 PM EST |
As I think of situations where the "hired hands" stop following their
mandates and start ripping off the system (you known elected union leaders,
colonies, politicians) I'm thinking there seems to a general prinicpal that if a
body B,sets up a mechemism M, to benefit B, that given enough X , M will move
from having a primary fuction of serving B, to a primary function of serving M.
Are there any Systems theorists out there that can eloberate on the standardized
name of general principal that is occuring here, how X is defined, etc. etc.
etc...
[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Darkelve on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 01:04 PM EST |
(And yes, De Telegraaf is a Dutch {=The Netherlands} newspaper. But in Belgium
there is a Dutch-*speaking* region too, called Flanders. The language is NOT
Flemish... Flemish does not exists as an official language {this is Dutch}, only
the different dialects in Flanders exists. The other part of Belgium speak
French and a minority speaks German.)
My own notes are between square brackets, i.e. []
TRANSLATION IN 'FULL' ENGLISH
Monday, 24 Jan 2005, 12:21PM
Decision about software patents delayed again
Brussels: this monday, the countries of the European
Union have again delayed a decision about the
introduction of a patent on software [litteral
translation, they probably mean: 'about the
introduction of software patents']. A spokesman for
Luxembourgh, the current holder of the EU presidency,
reported that this monday.
The decision was meant to be taken on monday, in the
margin of a meeting of Ministers of Agriculture.
However, there appeared to be unsufficient agreement
yet.
The patent on software [litteral tranlation, see my
previous remark] is quite disputed.
Small IT companies fear to get squeezed, because big
American companies ask for a patent on many
discoveries.
These little companies will have to pay big sums for
this, which would hamper the innoviation of [the]
software.
At a similar meeting in December, Poland blocked such a
decision.
The country [Poland] houses many small IT companies.
The European Parliament is not enthousiastic either.
Luxembourgh, which holds the EU presidency, could not yet
say when the decision is to be expected again.
LINE-BY-LINE TRANSLATION (Dutch first, followed by the
English translation {comes after the asteriks}
ma 24 jan 2005, 12:21
*Monday, 24 Jan 2005, 12:21PM
Besluit over software-octrooi weer uitgesteld
* Decision about software patents delayed again
BRUSSEL - De landen van de Europese Unie hebben
maandag een besluit over invoering van een octrooi op
software opnieuw uitgesteld. Een woordvoerder van
huidig EU-voorzitter Luxemburg heeft dat maandag
gemeld.
* Brussels: this monday, the countries of the European
Union have again delayed a decision about the
introduction of a patent on software [litteral
tranlation, they probably mean: 'about the
introduction of software patents']. A spokesman for
Luxembourgh, the current holder of the EU presidency,
reported that this monday.
Het besluit zou maandag genomen worden in de marge van
een vergadering van landbouwministers.
The decision was meant to be taken on monday, in the
margin of a meeting of Ministers of Agriculture.
Er bleek echter nog onvoldoende overeenstemming.
However, there appeared to be unsufficient agreement
yet.
Het octrooi op software is behoorlijk omstreden.
The patent on software [litteral tranlation, see my
previous remark] is quite disputed.
Kleine IT-bedrijven vrezen in de knel te komen omdat
grote Amerikaanse bedrijven op vele vindingen octrooi
aanvragen.
Small IT companies fear to get squeezed, because big
American companies ask for a patent on many
discoveries.
De bedrijfjes moeten daarvoor flink gaan betalen. Het
zou de vernieuwing van de software belemmeren.
These little companies will have to pay big sums for
this. This would hampter the innoviation of (the)
software.
Bij een soortgelijke vergadering in december
blokkeerde Polen een besluit.
At a similar meeting in December, Poland blocked a
decision.
Het land huisvest veel kleine IT-bedrijven.
The country [Poland] houses many small IT companies.
Ook het Europees Parlement is niet enthousiast.
The European Parliament is not enthousiastic either.
EU-voorzitter Luxemburg kon nog niet zeggen wanneer
het besluit opnieuw te verwachten is.
Luxembourgh, which holds the EU presidency, could not yet
say when the decision is to be expected again.[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 01:14 PM EST |
And support those people from Poland in their battle against software
patents.
Optionally, you can add a personal message to Wlodzimierz
Marcinski, Poland's Undersecretary of State at the Ministry of Science and
Information Technology, who spoke out at the EU Council meeting to prevent the
software patents disaster. (scroll down URL below).
Join the battle
against software patents and sign this "Thank you, Poland!" letter.
A copy of the "Thank you, Poland!" letter will be sent together with
all verified signatures and flowers to the Polish Ministry of Science and
Information Technology.
[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Brian S. on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 01:17 PM EST |
| When any new country joins the EU, the biggest problems which have to be
resolved involve imbalance between wealth and industries.
The biggest single
issue which has to be addressed as Poland integrates as a new member is its
Agriculture.
As someone noted earlier, they are quite well up in IT but
Agriculture employs a large proportion of the population and as I understand is
mostly small family owned farms which are years behind Western European
Agriculture. Of all the industries which Poland will require help and money to
integrate, Agriculture is right at the top.
I've seen front page newspaper
articles in UK papers about how much money Poland hopes to receive from the EU
to bring its agriculture more up to date.
They are being more brave than most
people realise. These Agriculture Ministers are surely the people most involved
in helping out Poland with it's agricultural situation.
I would guess they
are the people who could exert most leverage on Poland and they are probably not
too shy with their arm twisting. Brian S. [ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: eskild on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 02:48 PM EST |
Last tuesday the Danish PM decided to call for a new election to the danish
paliament.
The Socialist party decided to include their opposition to Software Patents in
their election topics.
The Social Democrats shortly afterwards decided to change their views from
lukewarm support to lukewarm opposition.
As the support of the social democrats would be nescesary (the current
government is a minority government with support from a nationalistic party with
a strong anti-EU agenda) Denmark in principle should at least abstain now.
So in effect Software Patents are now an election theme, but probably a very low
key one.
---
Eskild
Denmark[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: robert on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 03:09 PM EST |
But on the other hand, isn't it great that someone from the (geographically)
opposite side of Europe can stand up for what *I* believe in?
Don't forget to thank Poland (EU + Non-EU citizens both welcomed....)
http://thankpoland.info/[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Nivuahc on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 03:33 PM EST |
| Lately, I have been getting this a lot when I try to visit
Groklaw:
Warning: mysql_connect(): User groklaw has
already more than 'max_user_connections' active connections in
/public/vhost/g/groklaw/system/databases/mysql.class.php on line 108
Cannnot connect to DB server
I imagine it's because the
site is more and more popular these days, especially with all of the recent
news.
Is there anything that can be done about this?
---
My Doctor
says I have A.D.D... He just doesn't understand. It's not like... Hey! Look at
that chicken! [ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: sjgibbs on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:15 PM EST |
"Please rest assured that I will continue to follow this issue closely in
the forthcoming weeks when it is discussed and voted on both in the Legal
Affairs Committee, on which I sit"
Theresa Villiers, in individual correspondance.
Does anyone have any background on the Legal Affairs Committee?
SJG[ Reply to This | # ]
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- yes! - Authored by: nb on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:26 PM EST
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 04:39 PM EST |
Why cant the EC just add it to the agenda of a council meeting 2 weeks in
advance? Surely then, no-one can ask for it to be removed at the meeting (which,
as far as i understand, can only happen to items inserted within the 2 week
period), or are there ways to block these items too?[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: a_t on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 07:41 PM EST |
| I don't think a delay of one week is any sort of victory.
The main problem
we have is the lack of lobbying skills on our side even if we do at least have a
lobbying
guide so we know how to write to! But the ffii is asking for donations even to
be able to afford to stay in Brussels...
On the dark side, they have various
MEPs (of all major<
/a> poli
tical parties - and now we hear rumours about Graham Watson too) already
bought by microsoft and other big players, and media managers to get their
message into the press.
Dr Jeremy Philpott is the one who seems to be
cropping up this week: the register devoted
half their article to his pronouncements. He's a UKPO spokesman saying
everywhere how dangerous a precedent it would be to restart and tear up a
"common position" we'd reached after so much work. On his UKPO homepage he is
defined as a media relations manager. He used to be a patent examiner, now he's
a manager. He certainly knows what the issues are. In fact he has written a nice
summary, which I thought you might all like to read:
See especially pages 9,10,11,13!
Looks like he thinks
anything to increase speed of processing is a good patentable invention... [ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: gdeinsta on Monday, January 24 2005 @ 07:55 PM EST |
This comment was posted as a comment to
http://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&sid=20050124080334639&ti
tle=Bizarre+postings+timings%3A+PJ%2C+can+you+help%3F&type=article&order
=&hideanonymous=0&pid=265759#c265870
as an experiment and bug report. Besides the timer problems discussed in the
above-mentioned comment, I also noticed that if I try to comment on a comment
using the button at the top of the page (which has beside it the title of the
comment to which I am responding), when the Post a Comment page comes up the
Title field contains the original article title instead of the title of the
comment upon which I am commenting. I posted this comment that way and as you
can see it did not inherit the correct title (I added "Bug report:"
manually). I don't know where it will get put in the database. We'll see where
it ends up.[ Reply to This | # ]
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| Authored by: Naich on Tuesday, January 25 2005 @ 03:50 AM EST |
Blimey! I actually got a reply from an email I sent to DEFRA (who's head is on
the committee that would have put the item through if it hadn't been removed by
Poland) on Friday, when this first came to light. It seems that they didn't
want to tell me my it was being put through in one of their meetings at short
notice, preferring to pass my queries to the patent office. Now there is an
impartial source for information on these matters.
Thank you for
your e-mail of 21 January. It was passed to me, given the
Patent Office's
responsbility for intellectual property matters.
This is to let you know -
although you may already be aware by now -
that the Computer-implemented
inventions Directive did not make it to
the agenda of the EU's Agriculture
Council today.
I should also add that the inclusion of any Directive as an
'A point'
on the agenda of such a meeting is normal procedure. It permits
the
adoption of a linguistically and legally correct translation of the text
of
a Directive. But it can only take place after the text has been
discussed and
agreed at previous meetings of the Council responsible for
the subject area. (In
this case agreement was reached at the
Competitiveness Council in May 2004). If
the text had been adopted, it
would have been returned to the European
Parliament for further
dicussion i.e. Second Reading.
Janette
McNeill
Intellectual Property and Innovation Directorate
The Patent
Office
So there we have it. It's all perfectly normal.
Nothing to see here. Move along. Strange that she doesn't mention why it was
being put through on the Agriculture and Fisheries agenda or why it was added 2
days before the meeting, rather than the usual 2 weeks.
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| Authored by: Chris Lingard on Tuesday, January 25 2005 @ 06:31 AM EST |
The upper house is the Council of Ministers and is
attended by a minister from each of the EU's 25 national
governments, their identites depending on what is on the
agenda ; they fly into Brussels from their national
capitals, after having their national governments
tell them what to do and how to vote, then they fly
out again.
The upper house is like an international conference, and
is secretive as the what deals have been done.
The lower house is the European Parliament is composed
of 732 directly-elected MEPs. This is fairly open, and this
what we can effect with our lobbying. For instance Sir
Willian Gates is there right now buying lunches for MEPs
The Software Patent Act has had its first reading in the
lower house; and is now in the upper house.
The upper house has adopted a "common position" on the act,
so now it needs "rubber stamping" so that it can return to
the lower house. The next upper house comittee is the
External Relations Council meeting 31 January
The Legal Committee, known as "JURI", belongs to the
lower house, and cannot act until an act reaches the
lower house.
If an act reaches a second or third reading, than it becomes
much more difficult to change it; it requires a large
majority vote relative to the total number of MEP, and not
the number present in the house.
Write to your MEP so that they are aware, and can take
action in the lower house.
To affect the upper house lobby your national government
If the Software Act is seen as a vote looser; then your
minister in the upper house will change policy.
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| Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, January 27 2005 @ 09:33 AM EST |
"Laws are like sausages. It's better not to see them being made."
- Otto von Bismarck
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