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Fox, when should you be allowed to eat geese? | 277 comments | Create New Account
Comments belong to whoever posts them. Please notify us of inappropriate comments.
What Is Patentable With A Computer?
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, October 09 2012 @ 04:30 PM EDT
That's because the Circuit Court Judges keep finding goodie bags filled with all
kinds of Franklin goodies in them. (That's my opinion, and I'll stick with it
until proven wrong)

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

Fox, when should you be allowed to eat geese?
Authored by: dwheeler on Tuesday, October 09 2012 @ 06:37 PM EDT

This court doesn't intend to hurt the software industry (although it obviously does so). It's a different problem.

The problem that there's a fundamental conflict of interest, though it's not usually viewed in those terms and the justice system isn't really designed to deal with it. Any judge on this circuit has to be an expert on patents, by definition. But this very expertise makes them far more likely to be pro-patent in general, and thus less likely to see the HARM that their militantly pro-patent policies have created. Obviously some do see the harm, but it's hard to see the harm when you help run the system that causes it.

Usually a judge is asked to interpret some piece of legislation, under the assumption that the judge is a disinterested third party. For deciding a narrow patent question, I think that's still typically true. But in this situation, the question is whether or not a whole category of "cool new stuff" should be within their jurisdiction. In this case, the judges are not disinterested third parties at all. Instead, expanding the scope of patents gives them more power, prestige, and indirectly money. It even gives them a way to "prove" that they are important. I'm not saying that they are bribed - I do not think they are - but they are absolutely not disinterested.

People like Judge Posner, who do not specialize in patents, are more likely to have a balanced view, and focus on the INTENT of the law (not just the mechanics) and the societal and economic EFFECT of different laws and interpretations of law. After all, they can take a disinterested view and see the big picture. It's great that there are people with that larger, less parochial view.

If we pay people to evaluate patents and be part of the patent system, obviously they would tend to want to make more patents and expand the scope of patentability. It's not that the judges are incompetent or evil. I think most are very competent in their specialty, and I don't think they INTEND to do the harm they cause. But you're asking them to judge against their own self-interest, admit that they have damaged the country with their past rulings, and also to voluntarily reduce their own power and influence. Such rulings are, to say the least, highly unlikely.

It's like asking the fox when he should be allowed to eat geese. The fox is an expert on eating geese, right? Unsurprisingly, the fox will tell us that in his expert opinion (using his broad expertise) that there should be an unlimited scope for geese-eating. Of course, the geese are not experts in geese-eating, so no one lets the geese decide; the geese just get the opportunity to honk a few times before they get roasted. Similarly, an expert on patents will typically decide that there should be an unlimited scope for patents, because they have self-interested reasons to make that decision. Again, and again, and again.

This explains various delusions like "loading software into a machine creates a new machine". No it doesn't. Really, it just doesn't.

It'd be worth presenting the arguments against software patents, but I wouldn't expect the court to change its mind. Instead, it'd be fodder for the Supreme Court, which might hear the case. So please, present the arguments, so that they can be used for the appeal.

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

What Is Patentable With A Computer?
Authored by: Steve Martin on Tuesday, October 09 2012 @ 07:10 PM EDT

The Supreme Court already answered the Circuit Court's question, but the latter keeps ignoring the former. The answer was that if the subject matter was not patentable without a computer, then the same process is not patentable with a computer.

Could you provide a case citation? I'd like to read the decision.

---
"When I say something, I put my name next to it." -- Isaac Jaffe, "Sports Night"

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

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