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Difficulty in determining... | 1347 comments | Create New Account
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Difficulty in determining...
Authored by: Wol on Tuesday, June 12 2012 @ 04:01 PM EDT
Exactly. An electrical signal is a physical thing. It can be described. Is it a
current? Is it a voltage? How many amps? How many volts? DC or AC?

But the answer to that question is MEANINGLESS when talking about software
encoded by an electrical signal. You can know everything about that electrical
signal but still have no idea what it MEANS, what it SYMBOLIZES. Yet what it
symbolizes is all-important to the software. THAT is why software is abstract.
That is why software is totally separate from hardware. You can describe
hardware all you like, but that is useless to you if you want to know what it
MEANS.

(And has been pointed out, that software language like natural language, is
context dependent. For example, how would you pronounce the word
"read"? And what does it mean? Without context, neither question has
any meaning :-) And indeed, this is exactly how hard disks work - the bits - the
1s and 0s - are defined in terms of *change*, not absolute value.)

Cheers,
Wol

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

No,no,no!
Authored by: Anonymous on Tuesday, June 12 2012 @ 05:12 PM EDT
The loom card, CD, and DVD are NOT software, they are DATA.
They are REPRESENTATIONS of sound, moving pictures, a pattern
on cloth. Software is data that was executed to CREATE those
things, and, to then turn them into what they represent. This
software can stand alone (as firmware in a CD player), or be
executed in conjunction with an operating system, which is
also software. Software is executed, data is not.

Albert The Unregistered

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

Abstraction levels and reference levels..
Authored by: mbouckaert on Tuesday, June 12 2012 @ 05:29 PM EDT
IMHO a lot of the difficulties this discussion is running into comes from the fact that, in ordinary life, we confuse levels of abstraction and just call the whole set "it", and the same for levels of indirection.

As already told by Lewis Carroll

"...The name of the song is called 'Haddocks' Eyes'!"
"Oh, that's the name of the song, is it?" Alice said, trying to feel interested.
"No, you don't understand," the Knight said, looking a little vexed. "That's what the name is called. The name really is, 'The Aged Aged Man.'"
"Then I ought to have said "That's what the song is called'?" Alice corrected herself.
"No, you oughtn't: that's quite another thing! The song is called 'Ways and Means': but that's only what it is called you know!"
"Well, what is the song then?" said Alice, who was by this time completely bewildered.
"I was coming to that," the Knight said. "The song really is "A-sitting on a Gate": and the tune's my own invention."

But the Knight didn't patent that invention.

Now, "software" means different things to Practitioners and to Priests a.k.a. Lawyers.

Software-0: For what I can piece together, most Practitioners look at software as the text, which just is there, static, copyrightable. The text describes a set of operations on abstract symbols. The text isn't abstract symbols. It doesn't do anything to them either. Just like a mathematical proof, the text just is. It's math. You cannot patent that.

Software-N: Now the Priests have no interest in that whatsoever. They look at a different animal they call software, which is the set of actions performed by a physical machine. Like the Oracle, the machine then shows Results based on Input, with Results and Input in the physical world. By the way, this is also what a steam engine does. It exists, in time and space. The Priests then conclude that it must be patentable. And steadfastly refuse to even doubt that.

The misunderstanding is not dissipated by the existence of a third animal, also called "software". That one is what results when, in someone's mind or in a piece of equipment, one follows the text of Software-0. let me call that Software-I.

Software-I manipulates symbols (see PolR's explanation). Nothing changes in the physical world. When one begins to read the text of Software-0, few symbols exist: to paraphrase:

"In the beginning, the world (of Software-I) was without form and empty, and undefined-values was over the surface of the deep, and the sprit of the programming language moved over the surface of the computation".

And there was a test, and there was a bug. Thus was the first instruction. Scratch that.

Eventually, Software-I, following the text of Software-0, requires symbols to attach to things of the real world. In a mental process, and in some "debugging" cases, we call these "test values". This is generally called "I/O instructions". These do not exist in your mind. They can be wildly different from installation to installation; an I/O instruction here can result in injecting the proper amount of Sulfur and, in the real world, rubber starts curing. Over there, in the real world, the sameI/O instruction can cause centrifuges to spin out of control the "I/O instruction bridge" is what allows Software-N to exist.

To make matters more fun, one can have a whole collection of Software-I 'layers', each of them requiring a foundation of similar components until, going down towards the physical, one reaches silicon: JVM to VMBox to PC to microcode to silicon, or other examples.

>Note the three radically different steps: Static text , dynamic symbol manipulations, specific physical actions.

Software-0 is mathematical proof, found in books. Requires symbol- related conventions.

Software-I is mathematical process, theorem-proving, found in academic circles. It requires a few more things: Time as an ordered sequence of instants; and some abstraction of how to set some symbolic properties to other symbols (the I/O above).

Software-N is a physical process, where time is present, where there is a physical apparatus (not software) to bridge between reality and symbols, to assign real-world semantics to symbols.

We should at least start distinguishing between these. Then we can start looking at whether a given Software-N (actually, a physical, specific machine) is important enough to grant a State- manufactured monopoly and restrict People's freedom in so doing. Or whether that was done before. Or...

One of the immediate consequences of this would be that anything not attached to a specific physical apparatus cannot be patentable, and that any monopoly attached to a specific physical apparatus is limited to that specific apparatus.

Cheers,

---
bck

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

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