decoration decoration
Stories

GROKLAW
When you want to know more...
decoration
For layout only
Home
Archives
Site Map
Search
About Groklaw
Awards
Legal Research
Timelines
ApplevSamsung
ApplevSamsung p.2
ArchiveExplorer
Autozone
Bilski
Cases
Cast: Lawyers
Comes v. MS
Contracts/Documents
Courts
DRM
Gordon v MS
GPL
Grokdoc
HTML How To
IPI v RH
IV v. Google
Legal Docs
Lodsys
MS Litigations
MSvB&N
News Picks
Novell v. MS
Novell-MS Deal
ODF/OOXML
OOXML Appeals
OraclevGoogle
Patents
ProjectMonterey
Psystar
Quote Database
Red Hat v SCO
Salus Book
SCEA v Hotz
SCO Appeals
SCO Bankruptcy
SCO Financials
SCO Overview
SCO v IBM
SCO v Novell
SCO:Soup2Nuts
SCOsource
Sean Daly
Software Patents
Switch to Linux
Transcripts
Unix Books

Gear

Groklaw Gear

Click here to send an email to the editor of this weblog.


You won't find me on Facebook


Donate

Donate Paypal


No Legal Advice

The information on Groklaw is not intended to constitute legal advice. While Mark is a lawyer and he has asked other lawyers and law students to contribute articles, all of these articles are offered to help educate, not to provide specific legal advice. They are not your lawyers.

Here's Groklaw's comments policy.


What's New

STORIES
No new stories

COMMENTS last 48 hrs
No new comments


Sponsors

Hosting:
hosted by ibiblio

On servers donated to ibiblio by AMD.

Webmaster
More Simply Put...? | 439 comments | Create New Account
Comments belong to whoever posts them. Please notify us of inappropriate comments.
Ironic detail about "dynamic" that everyone seems to have missed
Authored by: dio gratia on Monday, May 14 2012 @ 08:59 PM EDT

Symbol table generically refers to structured data. There's more than one way to organize symbol data (e.g. List, Self Organizing List, Hash Table, Binary Search Tree). I'd be a little more careful and say if you are comparing the symbol to a stored value you are doing a symbolic reference. Oracle seemed to be trying to 'confuse a cat' by talking about numeric references, when names in Java must begin with a character.

You'd think a compiler writer could also demonstrate why the the class/method/object structure, sequence and organization of Java is functional, in that names as not copyright eligible organized in path names allows name reuse by limiting scope and visibility. The very reason why names can't be copyright, they aren't unique, they aren't original.

The SSO issue revolves around path names. See 1018, Final Charge To the Jury (Phase One) and Special Verdict Form, at 10, instruction 20:

Now, let me tell you the law about names. The copyrights do not cover the names, such as those given to files, packages, classes, and methods, because under the law, names cannot be copyrighted. This applies to the name “java” as well. Although “Java” has been registered as a trademark, there is no trademark claim in this lawsuit. The name java cannot be copyrighted, nor can any other name, whether one or two words or longer in length. While individual names are not protectable on a standalone basis, names must necessarily be used as part of the structure, sequence, and organization and are to that extent protectable by copyright.
It's this SSO, seemingly hierarchical names that allows names to be used locally. Java doesn't have a flat name space, and all names don't have to be unique. A path name makes a non-local name visible in the current scope without a local declaration or concern for reuse.

(And this is done by using a symbol table, too). (An example path name demonstrating SSO: java.io.File).

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

More Simply Put...?
Authored by: BitOBear on Tuesday, May 15 2012 @ 01:18 AM EDT
"Bring me the Oracle v Google File" is a demand for symbolic lookup
because you, the "bringer" must deal with finding the file in question
inside the file cabinet or storage box or whatever. Neither gross location nor
position within that location are of any interest, or even necessarily known to,
the entity making the request. On the average day the boss doesn't -care- how
you file the files.

"Bring me that thing that is on top of that desk" is a demand for
non-symbolic lookup. You have been told exactly where the thing to be fetched is
and your job is to go and get it. No thinking required. You are a pair of feet
and a grasping hand.

"Bring me the third file from that box there" is a table lookup, which
is still not symbolic. You are told where to go, and where within that larger
location, to find the thing. Again you are a pair of feet and a grasping hand.
You will, also have to be able to count to three this time, and you will have to
multiply by "size of file" or some such. The amount of time to
"figure out" this request is fixed and you, the fetcher thing, have no
duty to bring "the correct file, by name or any such" since you are
relying on the assumption that the files are already in the correct order and
the asker knows what he is asking for by that placement and order.

So, as always, pretend computers do not exist. If I ask you to get something
"by name" you know that names are "symbolic references" to
things. "BitOBear" is a symbolic reference to me in this context. If I
am also "Groklaw member 88832585765383" then that number -could- be a
symbolic name for me as well. The "number-ness or not" is not the
point. But if that were truely "my number" it isn't likely because
there are trillions of unique groklaw members since there are only billions of
unique people on the planet.

To get "the 45th thing from a bin" you do not have any
"symbolism" to deal with.

The "expert" is -deliberately- trying to conflate "a arbitrary
number used as a name" (which is -NOT- what is happening in this case) with
the mathematical entity "the number-eth slot in the box/table/list at
hand".

One can only assume he is either lying or very bad at his job if he claims this
conflation is correct or useful.

[ Reply to This | Parent | # ]

Groklaw © Copyright 2003-2013 Pamela Jones.
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective owners.
Comments are owned by the individual posters.

PJ's articles are licensed under a Creative Commons License. ( Details )