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No Legal Advice

The information on Groklaw is not intended to constitute legal advice. While Mark is a lawyer and he has asked other lawyers and law students to contribute articles, all of these articles are offered to help educate, not to provide specific legal advice. They are not your lawyers.

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A Reminder and a Thought
Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 06:46 PM EDT

Now that I've announced Groklaw articles will end in May, a number of lovely articles have appeared, and some beautiful comments have been posted here and elsewhere, not to mention a blizzard of emails I've received. Thank you, every one of you.

Some of you have asked me to figure out some place where the community can go to continue the work, even if I can't carry this work load any longer. I can't announce anything, but I will tell you that I'm trying to figure something out, and if it doesn't work out, it won't be because I haven't heard your concerns. I see your point, and while I have to change things personally, I agree that it is important to have a place on the Internet where the law is explained to geeks and tech to lawyers.

Also, some have been worried about archiving our research. It will be right here. The only change will be no new articles. I have to get out from under that work load to do other things. But Groklaw will be here, for researchers and lawyers and historians.

I've also seen a couple of articles resurrecting SCO's FUD against Groklaw, so let me direct you to this article, where years ago I responded to their lies about me and Groklaw. Also, you might wish to read our Mission Statement and our Awards page. They too will help you to identify the truth.

Not that the FUDsters will stop. If they could, they'd have stopped in 2007, when I responded in such detail. But for the rest of you, the facts are laid out there.

Ask yourself, did anything SCO say turn out to be true? Remember Darl's "mountain of evidence"? Extrapolate, and then you will not be misled.


A Reminder and a Thought | 120 comments | Create New Account
Comments belong to whoever posts them. Please notify us of inappropriate comments.
A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: hans on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 06:55 PM EDT

What fun.



[ Reply to This | # ]

Off Topic
Authored by: Kilz on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 07:05 PM EDT
Please make links the clicky kind.

[ Reply to This | # ]

[CORRECT] Corrections Thread
Authored by: artp on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 07:18 PM EDT
Changes in fact only. Opinions go elsewhere.

Eror -> Error

Userfriendly on WGA server outage:
When you're chained to an oar you don't think you should go down when the galley
sinks ?

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: Steve Martin on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 07:28 PM EDT
Man, there must be something in the water. One of our American TV networks (ABC)
announced today that they will be cancelling two of daytime TV's longest-running
programs (two of their soap operas) coming up in the months ahead.

I guess "the times, they are a-changin'".

"When I say something, I put my name next to it." -- Isaac Jaffe, "Sports Night"

[ Reply to This | # ]

Authored by: calris74 on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 07:44 PM EDT
Hmmm, I wonder if the most famous, most well respected, most
important tech writer in history has been archived in the
Library of Congress ;)

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Groklawyers Practicum
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 07:56 PM EDT

Websters gives this definition for Practicum: a course of study designed especially for the preparation
of teachers and clinicians that involves the supervised practical application of previously studied theory.

Many of those here have been studying and contributing for almost 8 years, their skill sets are diverse,
talents many, and knowledge broad. The challenge is in the application.

PJ has stated that after May 16 there will be no new articles and that commenting will be closed. That
leaves a 32 day window of opportunity for the Groklaw community to decide on and organize its own
continuity, should the will exist, while PJ is still available to act as our practicum advisor; if she would
consent to do so.

I propose that for the next 32 days a canonical discussion thread be created for that purpose.
I am going to call it Practicum Discussion for now, as a sub-thread to this one; others may change it or
not, create it or not. Getting all of the canonical threads needs to get tougher. :)

I personally believe it would be a shame to let what PJ and this community have created dissolve
without at least attempting, succeed or fail, to continue on. I also believe that it should be a new
site that is created, leaving Groklaw to stand as a completed work.

Disclaimer: Personal interest. I am a Groklaw addict.

Please don't feed the dinosaurs.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Hey Webster!
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 08:06 PM EDT
Would you be willing to pick up part of the torch?

I might be anonymous - but have really enjoyed you insight and writing style
into all thing legal ....

[ Reply to This | # ]

[NP] News Picks threads
Authored by: Aladdin Sane on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 08:29 PM EDT
News Picks discussion. Please say which one you're commenting on.

There is nothing unknowable—only that which is yet to be known. —The Fourth Doctor (Tom Baker)

[ Reply to This | # ]

[COMES] Comes v. MS transcripts
Authored by: Aladdin Sane on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 08:30 PM EDT
Please put Comes v. MS transcriptions here.

There is nothing unknowable—only that which is yet to be known. —The Fourth Doctor (Tom Baker)

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 08:52 PM EDT
I thought that "you" consisted of a team from IBM!! Maybe the other
memders could do they share now :-)

[ Reply to This | # ]

Authored by: inode_buddha on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 09:25 PM EDT
Indeed PJ, I've long felt that groklawers should have a designated place to
congregate and discuss after all this blows over. There will be other issues and
cases in the future I'm sure - we are already seeing a few of them hatch. Please
let us know, and thanks!


"When we speak of free software,
we are referring to freedom, not price"
-- Richard M. Stallman

[ Reply to This | # ]

Is the book coming?
Authored by: alansz on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 10:22 PM EDT
PJ, thanks for all your great work on Groklaw. I hope that the end of new
Groklaw articles will also mean that a Groklaw book chronicling the SCO and
Groklaw saga will soon be forthcoming.

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: artp on Thursday, April 14 2011 @ 11:57 PM EDT
I had been thinking lately that the FSF or some similar organization should be
subsidizing your work. Nobody (of my acquaintance) could afford to do this for
nothing for so long.

Perhaps the FSF is the right organization to pick this up. EFF maybe?

At any rate, it won't be the same without PJ at the helm. I know from my
experiences as a BBS sysop that the person leading the show determines how good
the show is. While a replacement is nice in theory, decorum just won't be the
same, nor will the directed efforts of the crew. And who will be able to delete
trolls with such flair (or leave them be as a bad example) ? PJ is able to write
so well, and with such knowledge and authority, that it is almost easy for this
engineer to follow along on legal issues.

You deserve a life. Enjoy it! I appreciate what you have given us. If your next
project becomes public, I expect that you'll let us know so that we can properly
appreciate it, too. If not, I'm sure it will be good, I just won't know how
good. :-)

I only regret that I was not able to help out more than the little bit that I

And, yes, I would like to keep hanging around this eclectic bunch of
non-mainstream software advocates, so I will be watching to see what poor
substitute appears for Groklaw.

What to do for a new home page, though?

Userfriendly on WGA server outage:
When you're chained to an oar you don't think you should go down when the galley
sinks ?

[ Reply to This | # ]

Further new web site name suggestion
Authored by: dmarker on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 01:11 AM EDT


موقع إنترنت GroklawUAE

also these ...

Other ideas



[ Reply to This | # ]

Authored by: The Mad Hatter r on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 01:25 AM EDT

Ask yourself, did anything SCO say turn out to be true? Remember Darl's "mountain of evidence"?
You sure you got the wording right on that? Shouldn't it have been 'molehill' for accuracy's sake?


[ Reply to This | # ]

  • Ummmmm - Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 01:37 AM EDT
  • Ummmmm - Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 06:13 AM EDT
  • Ummmmm - Authored by: hAckz0r on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 10:52 AM EDT
A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: ewe2 on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 02:50 AM EDT
I'm hoping one day you or someone "as told" by you can write
a book of the other side of this, it would be eye-opening. My
theory is that the little minds attempting to revise Groklaw
history are still trying to compete with you and its
community. a backhanded compliment really. They may well be
nervous that some such account may be imminent.

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: ThrPilgrim on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 04:10 AM EDT
Just think, if we can't all congregate here we will all go our separate ways,
infecting other sites with PJ's sense of fair play, decorum and fact based

I think PJ has built, possibly with out knowing it, a very large bomb here; and
her announcement of no new articles has just lit the fuse.

Expect a wailing and gnashing of teeth on other blogs as a horde of
ex-groklawers, with time on their hands, descend on them to expose the FUD, lies
and deceit.

Thank you PJ for giving us a unique insight in what was the once closed world of
(tech/law) [delete as appropriate].

Though I think you may never be forgiven for allowing us to inflict geek humor
on those pour defenseless lawyers :-)

Beware of him who would deny you access to information for in his heart he
considers himself your master.

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Different Reminder and Thought
Authored by: msfisher on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 08:33 AM EDT
Like lots of folks here, I started reading Groklaw shortly after it started and
came to rely on it not only for SCO coverage but for newspicks, off-topic topics
and other legal coverage.

With that in mind, PJ, please remember that the battle isn't over.

The sale of SCO doesn't end the SCO saga, does it? There's still arbitration
and IBM.

But more important is the coverage and research in areas other than SCO:
patents, copyrights, individual rights, free and open source software and how
the law works.

So here's the thought: don't stop writing. Just shift your focus and your
workload. I realize the legal and political manure seems to be getting too deep
for one person to handle and you're probably getting swamped by it. But you
have some remarkable people in the Groklaw community. See if they can write
articles (the Huffington Post tempest-in-a-teapot aside).

Could you at least think about it?

[ Reply to This | # ]

Mountain?? Molehill more like!
Authored by: SirHumphrey on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 09:08 AM EDT
And what species of moth lives in Blepp's briefcase?

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: vonbrand on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 09:31 AM EDT

PJ, I think this site should live on (not be just the mummified display of what has been acomplished here). There are some tasks still unfinished (the whole MSFT Comes stuff comes to mind), and others are unfolding. We will need a new leader, and I'd for one would love to have you as a sort of benevolent dictator/overseer somewhere in the shadows. But if you do really step aside, it would be a well deserved rest.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Red Dress Day?
Authored by: 1N8 M4L1C3 on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 09:45 AM EDT

Hi PJ,

As I've been around since the beginnings of Groklaw... ...I'm curious, will we ever have opportunity to see our faithful scribe in that infamous red dress? Inquiring minds need to know. *wink*

All the very best in your 'retirement' PJ!

On the 7th day, Linus saw that which he created and it was good... ...on the 8th day SCO litigated.

[ Reply to This | # ]

Just a suggestion
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 12:11 PM EDT

Could you arrange for a new empty article each day so that the regulars can
compete for the honor of doing the conical threads? It would also keep the
threads from getting too long. It's been quite a journey and I for one wish you


[ Reply to This | # ]

A Reminder and a Thought
Authored by: Anonymous on Friday, April 15 2011 @ 03:36 PM EDT
Quite possibly the suggestion has already been made in flurry of comments
following the announced end of (new) groklaw, but I'm reading through a crap
internet connection.

I would like to suggest a paying option for helping groklaw to continue. LWN
works (kind of) by subscription (native articles become free after a week;
subscribers are exempt from ads and have additional features that cost server
time for filtering comments), and I think many people would be prepared to give
it a try for groklaw. PJ would obtain some well-earned profit from her expertise
and would be able to use that money to delegate work and build up a small stable
of writers of similar disposition. Just to have the news picks would be really
useful, but in depth articles from some of the fsfe people etc and those behind
odf, etc etc would be unique. And involving more people should future proof this

Give it some real thought? How much would a few dollars a month raise for a very
good cause?

[ Reply to This | # ]

Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, April 16 2011 @ 03:23 AM EDT
Funny thing,I came back to Groklaw after a couple of days away,
and what a crowd (what is the plural?) of astroturfers. Eerily following
a repetition this morning on local radio of the quote attr. Tug McGraw
when asked if he preferred astroturf or real grass said:
"Dunno, I never smoked astroturf."

Which presents a dilemma for anyone wishing to carry on the GL
tradition. Will comments be members only, membership bespoke,
references from existingmembers; civilised tolerance of the illiterate
or ignorant; or silent <plonk>

[ Reply to This | # ]

Alternatives suggestion, please
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, April 17 2011 @ 02:58 PM EDT
While carrying on the Groklaw name without PJ at helm would
probably be bad for the reputation of both the old Groklaw
(potentially tainted by the mistakes of its successor) and
the new Groklaw (constantly compared to the idolized
original PJ).

And while the continued leadership by PJ is obviously not
going to happen (at least not forever and probably not past
May 16).

I suggest that PJ posts, in article form, a list of already
existing forums that (combined) caters to the needs and
tastes that used to be fulfilled so well by her work here.

This is similar to what a good Lawyer or Doctor does when
retiring and closing up shop without a direct successor:
Refer his/her clients to other practitioners in town, with
specific reasoned recommendations. It is dissimilar to what
happens when a retiring practitioner hands over all his
clients to either his former apprentice, the guy who bought
his office or simply the highest bidder.

[ Reply to This | # ]

A Place to Hang Out
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 18 2011 @ 03:27 PM EDT
Wouldn't 2 weekly (blank) posts be enough?

People can "post" in the comments section, and the site lives.

Would need a watchdog moderator ...


[ Reply to This | # ]

Thanks for all the fish
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, April 25 2011 @ 11:33 AM EDT
I really want to thank you for all your efforts to keep us informed. Now there
are a few things that will take some time to clean up, and I hope you do that.
Remember your core plans with Groklaw were to document what happened to the SCO
cases. I hope you keep about 6 more articles in mind. The rest can go
anywhere. It would be nice if we could find a place where could look for them,
but it does not have to be here.

Anyway I see articles directly related to SCO that will not make your cutoff
1-The rejection (my opinion) of SCO's latest appeal.
2-An attempt to re-appeal
3-Immediate Rejection (maybe can fit in with 2 above)
4-An infusion of money by Yarrow for supreme court appeal
5-The appeal
6-Their final rejection (if it ever gets posted).
7-Sometime in there SCO's chapter 7 filing.
This is going to take about a year and 1/2 to complete, but it isn't a full time
job any more.


[ Reply to This | # ]

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